Post by Pen7Ninja on Aug 13, 2015 5:26:03 GMT
Hey everyone,
I made this video:
It covers a bunch of basic pillow fighting techniques but at the same time, I probably could have said a little bit more about it. Details and stuff.
Please watch the video and have a look through the write up below.
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_________________________
Basic pillow fighting:
So there's 2 things here...
1. Both players are on the same level
2. One player is above the other player
I'm going to go over situation 1 first and move onto situation 2 later.
So super basic. You hold towards your opponent to hit them. They'll fall either onto a block (towards the camera) that's immediately below them and if there is none, they'll grab the ledge.
This means that you can't directly kill anyone with a normal pillow hit as they'll take the ledge at the very least.
In some stages you can punch them onto a black hole for example.
The game decides who wins in a situation based on a few things.
To put it simply... whoever presses towards their opponent first wins the exchange.
If both players happen to press the button on THE EXACT SAME FRAME then blue sheep will win the exchange. THIS IS THE ONLY TIME THAT BLUE SHEEP ADVANTAGE AFFECTS A PILLOW FIGHT.
Now there's 2 more situations within this where players are both on the same level...
One is where both players are next to each other and the other is when there's at least 1 block between characters.
When both players are together it's super simple. The person who presses towards their opponent first swings their pillow first and wins.
When there's a block in between, whoever pressed first will run into the space in between.
Because this player is now occupying that space but is not hit-able, the other player will not be able to move forwards.
Now in this situation, even though the first player needs to finish their running animation, they will still win the exchange as they moved first. This looks really odd when you look at it but the best way to look at it is to imagine that the moving player has "momentum" and they win because of this.
The 2nd situation, where one player is above the other...
This situation is much more dangerous because the player on top has the advantage and the one on the bottom will NOT grab the ledge and just fall down instead, possibly to their death.
If the player on the bottom holds towards the one on the top, they'll sit there and do nothing where the player on top will jump down and ruin their day.
There's not a whole lot to look at in this situation until a later subject because the player on the bottom has no chance to win in a standard "hold towards and pray" situation.
Combos:
This section covers only one type of combo. This one is pretty much the most basic type of combo you're going to get because it's just holding directions towards your opponent.
Jumping onto an opponent below you, as mentioned, knocks them down to the next block. It also means the following:
1. The person who got knocked down is now in a lot of recovery and can't move for a period of time
2. The person who jumped onto them did not go through a pillow fight animation so they are in very little recovery.
These 2 factors mean that the attacking player can continue walking at the other player and hitting them until they reach the bottom of the stage.
This requires very little execution but it can definitely be stopped.
There are some risks in attempting to stop this though (explained later), especially in some situations so it becomes somewhat of a mix-up as to whether you are going to continue your combo or let your opponent hang themselves in an attempt to stop you.
This combo works best when your opponent is only falling down 1 block at a time, don't attempt this when your opponent has to fall more than one block because the time it takes you to get hang onto the ledge and let go gives them enough time to move and punish your landing recovery.
Seeing combos and going for them, even just enough to represent them in your play is SO strong because it forces your opponent to choose whether they want to risk stopping it or take the rest of the combo hits.
Will post links here for information on other combos when information is available.
Removing the floor:
Removing the Floor is a name I had to come up with for a very common technique in this game. So common that it really didn't need a name at all.
Essentially, it's where you push or pull a block a block out from underneath your opponent causing them to fall.
This can also be done to blocks that your opponent is currently moving onto.
When this happens to a player, they will fall until they either die, land on a block or grab a ledge.
Dying sucks, landing on a block puts you in recovery, enough to get hit again and grabbing a ledge isn't even guaranteed.
To build on that, you will only grab a ledge if you're facing a ledge with no block directly above it.
If you happen to be facing the other way, you'll continue to fall past it.
Even when you do grab the ledge, a lot of situations end up with you holding the ledge, unable to move until your opponent hits you and you die.
This technique gives you an option for when your opponent is above you as you're sure as hell not winning a standard pillow fight in that situation. Unfortunately, this technique comes with a very real risk/reward related decision to be made.
The situation changes depending on whether you're pushing or pulling.
On pulling: the risk is that if your opponent is trying to stomp you, they're likely to just run along with the block as you pull it. This means they'll stay on top of it and you're either under them again or worse, in a sidle position.
The reward here is that you're often in a better spot afterwards whether your opponent falls for it or not.
Because you pulled a block, if your opponent lands on a block directly below, the follow-up hit is a jump down instead of a pillow hit which has better rewards. If your opponent doesn't fall for it, you're generally in a better position to continue climbing.
On pushing: the risk here is much different. It takes much more of a hard bait to cause this to fail but at the same time, the result of this failing is much worse and along with that, sometimes the reward of a successful push is less than that of a pull.
If your opponent decides to move away from or not even stand on the block you push out, that block is now gone, you pushed it away. This can cause some situations to become un-climbable where you would have been fine on a pull.
On the other hand, if this works, your resulting follow up (if they don't fall to their death) is usually a just pillow hit.
So to sum that up... there's more chance of a pull going wrong but it's less of an issue and the reward is better.
The Dragon Punch:
The Dragon Punch, named after popular fighting game stuff, commonly referred to as a "DP" but I didn't use that in the video because uhh... it has other uhh... you all played Catherine, you're old enough to figure it out.
The situation we're looking at here is actually just a combination of the 2 previous subjects.
The truth is that while you can't simply run left or right out of the standard combo above, it's actually not a true combo.
By using the invincibility provided by pushing a block (pulling will just have your opponent walk with the block) you can break this combo by pushing the block out from underneath your opponent.
This often results in a guaranteed with via either them falling to their death or you getting a game-winning pin. This makes going for a combo a massive risk/reward situation.
It's important to know that this will not get you out of some of the more situational combos, only the ones where you continuously stomp onto them from above.
Everything else that applies here has been explained above.
Go nuts.
The Option Select:
The option select... isn't really an option select.......
With that out of the way though, it's still very useful.
Here's the deal... Sometimes you want to step down onto your opponent to knock them down and get them off your back but with the fact that they could always just push the floor out from under you instead of moving to where you expect them to, jumping down can mean your own death.
The option select removes the danger from this situation by causing you to sidle instead of just being super dead.
The execution is super easy... just pull a block in the direction you wish to move instead of just walking there normally.
you just need to be sure that you'll either have a way back up to your higher position or be able to camp it out for the win once you're in this spot because you wont be able to simply climb back up now that there's a block there.
The option select goes like this...
Your opponent stands on the block below you
- You start sidling there and hit them off
Your opponent pushes out the block below you, expecting you to jump down to it
- You're left sidling, they potentially have less ways to climb now that the block is gone
Your opponent waits to see what you do
- You're left in a sidle defence situation. Your opponent can't go to this spot now and is forced to find another route.
Usually I talk about counters to these sorts of techniques here but the option select is pretty string in that you can't really do to much about it outside of some rather specific situations.
Your best options are to leave and avoid the situation all together or to push out the block in hopes that they wont option select and just die instead.
Sidle Defence:
I mentioned sidle defence in the section above, here's what it's all about...
Sidle defence is simply the act of sidling where your opponent wants to be.
Because the sidle position counts you as occupying the space below you, your opponent can't walk/climb onto it.
Along with this, you cannot be hit from the side (normal pillow fight) while you are sidling.
ALSO! While you're sidling, you're not actually standing on the block, so people can't push blocks out from under
This means that sidle defence is a really strong way to stop your opponent from mindlessly climbing after you.
If they only have one option up and you have the option to sidle there, do it.
They'll need to create a second way up or force you down somehow, wasting precious time.
This one's really simple so there's not much to say I guess.
As for ways around this, you have a few options:
- Create 2 ways up at the same time. It's impossible to cover 2 separate options with a sidle defence at the same time.
- Push out the block they're holding. Sometimes you can get beside the block and push it out. This will stop the sidle.
- Cause their blocks to fall. If you have no other way out, start pushing blocks from below them. If the block your sidling on falls, you lose your sidle. Use this to force them out of the sidle state and continue on a normal game.
Causing Whiffs:
Causing whiffs is a fun pillow fighting footsies sort of thing you can do to get the upper hand where you usually wouldn't win a "both players hold inwards" situation.
It works on the facts that you are actually invincible while moving between blocks and that there's some start-up to the pillow swinging animation involved in grounded pillow fighting.
Causing a whiff is actually pretty simple then. All you need to do is run towards any block on the same level that's obviously not the one occupied by your opponent. They'll then swing at you during your invincibility and you wont get hit.
This can be used as a way to punish your opponent for being too reckless and just trying to hit you as if you're fast enough, you can actually move back to the square you were on and hit them for free.
Beware that it's actually somewhat difficult to confirm that you've caused the whiff (especially if it's not on purpose) and get back in time to hit them without them being able to cause you to whiff in return.
In terms of beating this? Just be aware that it's happening.
There's actually a 50/50 situation going on because (on the assumption you're at advantage)...
You swinging: Loses to them causing whiff - wins against straight pillow fight
You not swinging: Loses to straight pillow fight - draws/wins against causing whiff (nobody gets hit but you can gain ground)
You have a create-a-block and mash square: Loses to straight pillow fight - Wins to causing whiff (explained below
)
Also remember that this can only be done to flat ground.
Trying to climb up or down when somebody is trying to hit you will definitely still get you hit.
Use this information when trying to stop people from making you whiff... set up a situation where they can't run to flat ground.
Create-A-Block Crush:
This one's fun.
It basically involves throwing a create-a-block item at your opponent to crush them.
This usually doesn't work as the game refuses to let you throw a block onto an occupied space but due to a property where the game considers you in 2 places at once (something that will require it's own video), you can crush people with blocks in some situations.
The execution for this is simple really... simply mash (or press, if you're a baller) the square button to throw a block as somebody is leaving the space you're facing.
This works when your opponent tries to walk on flat ground or climbs up but not when they climb down.
There's not really much else to this. It has it's uses in higher level play in that it completely kills any attempt to make pillow fights whiff but it loses to people just trying to fight you head on (which is what lower level players will do).
So if you expect your opponent to cause a whiff, give this a go.
A good situation is when you're clearly at an advantage and will win the fight like when somebody is climbing up to you and you expect that they'll try to run away to avoid the hit.
a PERFECT situation to use this in is when standing facing a torture chamber spike block that your opponent may walk by... If they come to that block and try to hit you, the spikes kill them, if they come to that block and run in any direction that's not down to a lower level, you squash them.
This is commonly referred to as "The Unblockable"
_________________________________
_________________________________
Uhhh... that's it, I suppose.
I'm trying to get more videos out there but I've been working on some other stuff and also trying to finish story mode for the first time... soooo... Soon.
I made this video:
It covers a bunch of basic pillow fighting techniques but at the same time, I probably could have said a little bit more about it. Details and stuff.
Please watch the video and have a look through the write up below.
_________________________
_________________________
Basic pillow fighting:
So there's 2 things here...
1. Both players are on the same level
2. One player is above the other player
I'm going to go over situation 1 first and move onto situation 2 later.
So super basic. You hold towards your opponent to hit them. They'll fall either onto a block (towards the camera) that's immediately below them and if there is none, they'll grab the ledge.
This means that you can't directly kill anyone with a normal pillow hit as they'll take the ledge at the very least.
In some stages you can punch them onto a black hole for example.
The game decides who wins in a situation based on a few things.
To put it simply... whoever presses towards their opponent first wins the exchange.
If both players happen to press the button on THE EXACT SAME FRAME then blue sheep will win the exchange. THIS IS THE ONLY TIME THAT BLUE SHEEP ADVANTAGE AFFECTS A PILLOW FIGHT.
Now there's 2 more situations within this where players are both on the same level...
One is where both players are next to each other and the other is when there's at least 1 block between characters.
When both players are together it's super simple. The person who presses towards their opponent first swings their pillow first and wins.
When there's a block in between, whoever pressed first will run into the space in between.
Because this player is now occupying that space but is not hit-able, the other player will not be able to move forwards.
Now in this situation, even though the first player needs to finish their running animation, they will still win the exchange as they moved first. This looks really odd when you look at it but the best way to look at it is to imagine that the moving player has "momentum" and they win because of this.
The 2nd situation, where one player is above the other...
This situation is much more dangerous because the player on top has the advantage and the one on the bottom will NOT grab the ledge and just fall down instead, possibly to their death.
If the player on the bottom holds towards the one on the top, they'll sit there and do nothing where the player on top will jump down and ruin their day.
There's not a whole lot to look at in this situation until a later subject because the player on the bottom has no chance to win in a standard "hold towards and pray" situation.
Combos:
This section covers only one type of combo. This one is pretty much the most basic type of combo you're going to get because it's just holding directions towards your opponent.
Jumping onto an opponent below you, as mentioned, knocks them down to the next block. It also means the following:
1. The person who got knocked down is now in a lot of recovery and can't move for a period of time
2. The person who jumped onto them did not go through a pillow fight animation so they are in very little recovery.
These 2 factors mean that the attacking player can continue walking at the other player and hitting them until they reach the bottom of the stage.
This requires very little execution but it can definitely be stopped.
There are some risks in attempting to stop this though (explained later), especially in some situations so it becomes somewhat of a mix-up as to whether you are going to continue your combo or let your opponent hang themselves in an attempt to stop you.
This combo works best when your opponent is only falling down 1 block at a time, don't attempt this when your opponent has to fall more than one block because the time it takes you to get hang onto the ledge and let go gives them enough time to move and punish your landing recovery.
Seeing combos and going for them, even just enough to represent them in your play is SO strong because it forces your opponent to choose whether they want to risk stopping it or take the rest of the combo hits.
Will post links here for information on other combos when information is available.
Removing the floor:
Removing the Floor is a name I had to come up with for a very common technique in this game. So common that it really didn't need a name at all.
Essentially, it's where you push or pull a block a block out from underneath your opponent causing them to fall.
This can also be done to blocks that your opponent is currently moving onto.
When this happens to a player, they will fall until they either die, land on a block or grab a ledge.
Dying sucks, landing on a block puts you in recovery, enough to get hit again and grabbing a ledge isn't even guaranteed.
To build on that, you will only grab a ledge if you're facing a ledge with no block directly above it.
If you happen to be facing the other way, you'll continue to fall past it.
Even when you do grab the ledge, a lot of situations end up with you holding the ledge, unable to move until your opponent hits you and you die.
This technique gives you an option for when your opponent is above you as you're sure as hell not winning a standard pillow fight in that situation. Unfortunately, this technique comes with a very real risk/reward related decision to be made.
The situation changes depending on whether you're pushing or pulling.
On pulling: the risk is that if your opponent is trying to stomp you, they're likely to just run along with the block as you pull it. This means they'll stay on top of it and you're either under them again or worse, in a sidle position.
The reward here is that you're often in a better spot afterwards whether your opponent falls for it or not.
Because you pulled a block, if your opponent lands on a block directly below, the follow-up hit is a jump down instead of a pillow hit which has better rewards. If your opponent doesn't fall for it, you're generally in a better position to continue climbing.
On pushing: the risk here is much different. It takes much more of a hard bait to cause this to fail but at the same time, the result of this failing is much worse and along with that, sometimes the reward of a successful push is less than that of a pull.
If your opponent decides to move away from or not even stand on the block you push out, that block is now gone, you pushed it away. This can cause some situations to become un-climbable where you would have been fine on a pull.
On the other hand, if this works, your resulting follow up (if they don't fall to their death) is usually a just pillow hit.
So to sum that up... there's more chance of a pull going wrong but it's less of an issue and the reward is better.
The Dragon Punch:
The Dragon Punch, named after popular fighting game stuff, commonly referred to as a "DP" but I didn't use that in the video because uhh... it has other uhh... you all played Catherine, you're old enough to figure it out.
The situation we're looking at here is actually just a combination of the 2 previous subjects.
The truth is that while you can't simply run left or right out of the standard combo above, it's actually not a true combo.
By using the invincibility provided by pushing a block (pulling will just have your opponent walk with the block) you can break this combo by pushing the block out from underneath your opponent.
This often results in a guaranteed with via either them falling to their death or you getting a game-winning pin. This makes going for a combo a massive risk/reward situation.
It's important to know that this will not get you out of some of the more situational combos, only the ones where you continuously stomp onto them from above.
Everything else that applies here has been explained above.
Go nuts.
The Option Select:
The option select... isn't really an option select.......
With that out of the way though, it's still very useful.
Here's the deal... Sometimes you want to step down onto your opponent to knock them down and get them off your back but with the fact that they could always just push the floor out from under you instead of moving to where you expect them to, jumping down can mean your own death.
The option select removes the danger from this situation by causing you to sidle instead of just being super dead.
The execution is super easy... just pull a block in the direction you wish to move instead of just walking there normally.
you just need to be sure that you'll either have a way back up to your higher position or be able to camp it out for the win once you're in this spot because you wont be able to simply climb back up now that there's a block there.
The option select goes like this...
Your opponent stands on the block below you
- You start sidling there and hit them off
Your opponent pushes out the block below you, expecting you to jump down to it
- You're left sidling, they potentially have less ways to climb now that the block is gone
Your opponent waits to see what you do
- You're left in a sidle defence situation. Your opponent can't go to this spot now and is forced to find another route.
Usually I talk about counters to these sorts of techniques here but the option select is pretty string in that you can't really do to much about it outside of some rather specific situations.
Your best options are to leave and avoid the situation all together or to push out the block in hopes that they wont option select and just die instead.
Sidle Defence:
I mentioned sidle defence in the section above, here's what it's all about...
Sidle defence is simply the act of sidling where your opponent wants to be.
Because the sidle position counts you as occupying the space below you, your opponent can't walk/climb onto it.
Along with this, you cannot be hit from the side (normal pillow fight) while you are sidling.
ALSO! While you're sidling, you're not actually standing on the block, so people can't push blocks out from under
This means that sidle defence is a really strong way to stop your opponent from mindlessly climbing after you.
If they only have one option up and you have the option to sidle there, do it.
They'll need to create a second way up or force you down somehow, wasting precious time.
This one's really simple so there's not much to say I guess.
As for ways around this, you have a few options:
- Create 2 ways up at the same time. It's impossible to cover 2 separate options with a sidle defence at the same time.
- Push out the block they're holding. Sometimes you can get beside the block and push it out. This will stop the sidle.
- Cause their blocks to fall. If you have no other way out, start pushing blocks from below them. If the block your sidling on falls, you lose your sidle. Use this to force them out of the sidle state and continue on a normal game.
Causing Whiffs:
Causing whiffs is a fun pillow fighting footsies sort of thing you can do to get the upper hand where you usually wouldn't win a "both players hold inwards" situation.
It works on the facts that you are actually invincible while moving between blocks and that there's some start-up to the pillow swinging animation involved in grounded pillow fighting.
Causing a whiff is actually pretty simple then. All you need to do is run towards any block on the same level that's obviously not the one occupied by your opponent. They'll then swing at you during your invincibility and you wont get hit.
This can be used as a way to punish your opponent for being too reckless and just trying to hit you as if you're fast enough, you can actually move back to the square you were on and hit them for free.
Beware that it's actually somewhat difficult to confirm that you've caused the whiff (especially if it's not on purpose) and get back in time to hit them without them being able to cause you to whiff in return.
In terms of beating this? Just be aware that it's happening.
There's actually a 50/50 situation going on because (on the assumption you're at advantage)...
You swinging: Loses to them causing whiff - wins against straight pillow fight
You not swinging: Loses to straight pillow fight - draws/wins against causing whiff (nobody gets hit but you can gain ground)
You have a create-a-block and mash square: Loses to straight pillow fight - Wins to causing whiff (explained below
)Also remember that this can only be done to flat ground.
Trying to climb up or down when somebody is trying to hit you will definitely still get you hit.
Use this information when trying to stop people from making you whiff... set up a situation where they can't run to flat ground.
Create-A-Block Crush:
This one's fun.
It basically involves throwing a create-a-block item at your opponent to crush them.
This usually doesn't work as the game refuses to let you throw a block onto an occupied space but due to a property where the game considers you in 2 places at once (something that will require it's own video), you can crush people with blocks in some situations.
The execution for this is simple really... simply mash (or press, if you're a baller) the square button to throw a block as somebody is leaving the space you're facing.
This works when your opponent tries to walk on flat ground or climbs up but not when they climb down.
There's not really much else to this. It has it's uses in higher level play in that it completely kills any attempt to make pillow fights whiff but it loses to people just trying to fight you head on (which is what lower level players will do).
So if you expect your opponent to cause a whiff, give this a go.
A good situation is when you're clearly at an advantage and will win the fight like when somebody is climbing up to you and you expect that they'll try to run away to avoid the hit.
a PERFECT situation to use this in is when standing facing a torture chamber spike block that your opponent may walk by... If they come to that block and try to hit you, the spikes kill them, if they come to that block and run in any direction that's not down to a lower level, you squash them.
This is commonly referred to as "The Unblockable"
_________________________________
_________________________________
Uhhh... that's it, I suppose.
I'm trying to get more videos out there but I've been working on some other stuff and also trying to finish story mode for the first time... soooo... Soon.